#99 – Interview with Arnold Beekes: Unconditioning, Mental Freedom, and Authentic Living

Today on "Poder aprender", I'm speaking with Arnold Beekes, a speaker, author, and

futurist with a powerful mission, helping people move from fitting in to flying out.

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With a background that spans corporate leadership, psychology,

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and now brain fitness, Arnold is on a quest to dismantle the mental and emotional straight

jackets that keep us small.

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He believes that the future belongs to those who uncondition themselves, those who reclaim

their mental freedom, unleash their uniqueness and live their own lives.

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In this conversation, we explore the art of unconditioning, brain fitness,

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and what it really takes to break free from a life of conformity.

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Arnold, it's great having you here.

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Welcome to "Poder aprender".

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Thank you very much Walter, it's a privilege.

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Arnold, you often speak about the journey from fitting in to flying out.

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What was the first time you realized you were living someone else's life?

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It's not a moment, it's exactly like you said, it's a journey.

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It's a process.

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It's really a process, but the process started where I lost my job in the corporate world.

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Yeah.

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So there was not so much about building a startup, starting your own business.

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The only thing which existed was basically people would go freelance and, and, and, or a

little bit starting their own thing, but I was like, I don't like bosses.

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I don't like working anymore.

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Like I'm going to start my own thing, whatever that was going to be.

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And.

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And that is when I realized that although I was in the corporate world quite successful, I

basically knew nothing about myself.

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I knew the mental qualities and capacities to deal in and with business.

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That's what I knew and I was pretty good at.

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I knew nothing about myself.

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knew nothing about emotions, spirituality, environment, social aspects.

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And that was the realization in like, well, I've been in a very confined world, the

corporate world, where I thought that it, that was the world.

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But then I stepped

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out of that world, I'm like, holy moly, there is so much more where I had no clue about.

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So it's like moving in terms of your languages and moving to other countries and cultures

is like, would go to another country and I no clue how it would look like.

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That's wonderful.

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And that makes me think also of...

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When you say fitting in, and when we're talking about fitting in, I have an idea of what

that means, like being compliant or trying to being adequate to certain thing.

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And I wonder about flying out.

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What do you mean by that?

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Fitting in my definition is you start living someone else's life and flying out means you

start to live your own life.

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Allow me to explain.

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The fitting in starts for most people the moment you're born, the moment you're a baby and

Walter comes into your father and mother.

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They very soon start to make you do what they want you to do.

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Don't cry at night, eat your food, don't spoil the stuff.

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Everything like that.

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That's the moment they start to

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mold you in the way they want.

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Well, maybe you go to kindergarten, but let's say you go to primary school.

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What do they do at primary school?

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They make you do what they want you to do and how to behave and be quiet and sit still and

do your homework and ask, raise your hand when you have a question or want to go to the

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toilet or whatever.

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m

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That's the same thing throughout your old school, primary school, high school, maybe you

go to some vocational training or university.

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They all have a certain agenda and a certain goal where they, well, what I say, they

condition you in a certain way.

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So by the time a person is 20, 25, the only thing what we have learned and if we are

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with it, and I'm not talking about the renegades or rebels or whatever it is, to meet the

expectations of other people.

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When was Walter, when was Arnold a good kid?

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When you do exactly what your parents tell you to do.

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When are you a good student?

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When you do exactly what your teacher tells you to do or professor or whatever label you.

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And then you start to work.

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When is your boss happy with you when you do exactly what he tells you to do?

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In other words, you're not living your own life, you're living the life of your parents,

teachers and bosses.

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Right.

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Yeah.

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It's like we learn how to be disciplined by others.

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And I know that you, this is something you also talked about how you were raised in a very

strict military household and there were very strict rules.

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And then throughout your high school years and when you were young, and that's also what

happens to most of us to different degrees, we learn how to be disciplined based on

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what others tell us to do.

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And what is the role of discipling and discipling in ourselves when we want to get out of

that and when we want to fly out?

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Well, like everything, because we live in a duality, discipline has good aspects and it

got not so good aspects.

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The really good ones are, like, well, when you get to school and everything is like, well,

you got to be obedient, you got to do what they say, you got to be on time, you got to do

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whatever.

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Those things I already knew from home.

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Yes, so for me, it was like that was easy.

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But to give another example, my first job at a multinational and well, let's say that one

of the biggest bosses in the division literally was a big guy.

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He was

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He looked like an angry man.

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He was a big man.

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Always looked like this.

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His communication was, yes, no, I'm not exaggerating this, way he communicated.

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Everybody was afraid of him.

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And when I can still recall, there was some kind of an introduction meeting, a weekend

somewhere with new people, new employees and whatever.

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I started challenging him because he said something, said, well, maybe it's a little bit

different or maybe like that.

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And all the people were like, oh, Arnold will have a problem because he's a new guy and he

starts to ask questions and to do this.

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As opposed to the other guys, I was not afraid of him because I had lived with, well, by

that time, let's say I was 26, 27, I'd lived 26 years with my father.

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So I'm like, piece of cake.

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See, like, you see, that worked to my advantage.

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So that discipline and also not at the same time is like, because that person has the

label, he's the boss, he knows the truth.

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I knew that it was not true.

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So the discipline is a good thing and a negative thing.

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The negative thing is that you can see it as a goal in itself, but discipline is like,

helping you on your journey to get where you want to go.

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So it's like I said, is that you got to use it in a

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in a way that supports what you're doing rather than limits what you're doing.

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Yeah.

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So in order to make you do the things that you want to do, so get yourself to do the

things that you want to do that you know are good for yourself and that are aligned to

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your goals.

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So that's how you use discipline.

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Yeah, I'll give a very easy but powerful example.

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Like I said, now, well, I didn't say it, like 25 years I'm running my own business.

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That could mean I could stay in my bed all day.

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I could stay here.

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I could get out of my bed at 11 in the morning and every night, well, drink beer or

whatever I want, because nobody's going to say, Arnold, you're not allowed to do that.

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And Arnold, you didn't show up on time.

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Nobody's going to say that.

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It's...

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But my discipline is helping me.

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If I wouldn't have my discipline, I would never be where I am today.

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Because, instance, I found out, I learned that for sleep, your sleep rhythm is really

crucial that you get to bed at the same time and you get out of bed at the same time,

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seven days a week.

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That might sound challenging to people, but I introduced it to myself and it

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helps a lot.

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It works great.

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But that means if I want to see a football match like, well, what was it?

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Saturday when there was the champion league final.

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Normally I would watch that, but over here it's too late.

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So I'm like, I'm not going to watch it.

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That's my discipline.

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Yeah.

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So that's in service of your own long-term health.

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And I love what you say about going to bed at the same time and getting up at this, the

same time.

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And this is something that is very underestimated lately.

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And I, I came to, to learn about this.

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I use a whoop.

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So one of those fancy bands.

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And so here's called sleep consistency.

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And this is one of the, is it as an important...

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sorts of information and the data.

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And sometimes it can be even more important that the amount of sleep you're getting, like

the consistency that you're getting.

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So this is very in line to to scientific research and like the latest data we have on

sleep performance and how we can do better.

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And sleep is such an important thing.

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And I recently been paying more attention and it's hard.

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And at the same time, it's like,

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It's so basic and it's so fundamental and so available to most of us.

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That's something that we can do.

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And at the same time, it's so challenging because the temptations are endless.

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Like to stay up at night to get up late, especially for an entrepreneur.

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Like I just say, if we don't rule ourselves, there's no one else ruling us.

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Yeah, but at the same time, if you start applying it, you will see the benefits.

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And then the other end, what I noticed is if you use it, if I don't do it, I'm very

disappointed in myself.

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Yeah.

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besides that, I wouldn't feel rested or having a headache or whatever.

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It's like, was like, oh, Arnold, that was really shitty behavior.

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It's like, it's so...

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it, I, well, instead of external validation, I start to validate myself.

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Yeah.

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It's like you started letting yourself down.

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Yeah, yeah, but it's like, hey, I, in essence, I was not good for myself.

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the same thing happened.

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Let me give another example.

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Walter is like, when I stopped drinking alcohol.

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I was used to drinking alcohol every day.

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And then I made the decision to stop.

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Which by doing it, fortunately, well, I would have been close to addiction, but I wasn't

so I could stop and there were no physical problems.

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But your environment, that's what you meant.

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Your environment is, has a huge influence on that.

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Yeah.

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It's like, yeah, I was playing hockey and after the hockey match, we would, we would drink

a beer.

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Or like, would you like a beer?

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No.

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Huh?

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Are you okay?

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Yeah.

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Yeah, or their parties, or the opposite is like, had really a lousy day and you would like

to drink some alcohol, or you cannot sleep and you would say, yeah, and eat, or you feel

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sick and you need some alcohol.

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All these things, no, not going to do it.

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That's tough.

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Mm.

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But again, it's like, that's the beginning.

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Once you get through the process...

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I literally am now sick if you want me to drink one sip of alcohol.

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I will be sick.

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I noticed because it was two years ago, I drink in the weekend alcohol-free beer and in

the shelter were all these were all alcohol-free beer, but apparently they had set a

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bottle or a can on the wrong place.

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oh

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I just opened up the can and drinking and the first step I did, know, and then after sip

two, was like, maybe I'm getting sick.

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I don't know what happened, but I really feel sick.

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Feel nauseous, whatever.

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And then I, at some point I looked at the can, was like, moly, it's got alcohol in it.

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I was really, I was really sick after just two sips.

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So I was like, oh, that's really good news.

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So even if I tried.

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I feel really sick.

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Yeah, you develop more sensitivity to that.

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And I was also thinking when, you were speaking about, like what you mentioned of when you

spoke up to that boss, you were in that corporate environment, that big boss.

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And I was thinking also on the role of discomfort in all this conformity.

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In that moment, you decided to speak up and you were willing to...

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maybe it wasn't so uncomfortable for you because you practice and you had some repetitions

at home because of the house where you were brought up.

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And let's say that someone wants is feeling that discomfort and in conformity and wants to

start breaking free from that.

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This, this person feeling the discomfort of conformity.

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and wants to break free.

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What are the first steps to breaking free and flying out?

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Well, your first step is that you will most likely feel fear.

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Because you are going to do something uncomfortable and you know it and you're anxious,

you're worried.

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How will people react?

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How will I respond?

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How will I do it?

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And it's like, I don't want to do it.

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And it might be painful or it might be not nice.

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Whatever.

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But any change, well, I don't know whether it was intentionally or not, but you made a

nice thing.

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It looked like the same word, like discomfort and conformity.

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Conformity means you are very comfortable in your situation and you're most likely you

have all your habits and your process and everything.

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I'm used to doing this.

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That's where I feel comfortable.

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That's what I would like to continue doing.

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When you're this comfortable, because you step out of your conformity and say, hey, I'm no

longer going to do that.

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That creates uncertainty.

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is so besides fear, it will create uncertainty is like, I don't know whether I can do it

or how it will work out.

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For instance, let me take the example of me

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stopping with alcohol.

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had a date when I stood up, but I didn't know whether I would get shaky hands or I would

be because I drink a lot of alcohol.

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So I was like, maybe there are now some signs popping up that I'm really addicted.

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I didn't know.

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So that creates uncertainty, that creates discomfort.

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But any change is in the beginning uncomfortable.

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So you got to be comfortable in being uncomfortable.

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That's what I teach people.

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It's part of the process and we forget about it, but when we were young, very young, well,

I cannot recall when I started to walk or whatever, you were first crawling and then you

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start to walk.

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That was not comfortable from the very beginning.

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I can still recall starting to bike and even later on when I had to learn how to drive a

car.

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And in Netherlands, most of you have manual gearbox.

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It's not easy, but looking in the bike, it's it's something where you think it's not

difficult or easy because everybody's doing it.

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And then you start to do it for the first time and you're like, well, this is more

difficult than I thought.

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And so you feel very uncomfortable and you're like, wow, this is difficult.

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I can still remember when I had to learn how to drive in the car.

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I was like, I'm never going to learn this.

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This is so difficult.

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Yeah, because it was like, yeah, you had to...

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put with the ones with the brake and the other ones the gas and the other ones the clutch

and then you have the gearbox and then you have to look in your mirrors.

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I was looking like this.

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what's in the window?

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Oh, I've to do this.

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I was like, there's too much.

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I cannot do it.

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That's being uncomfortable, but that's part of any change.

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You are a wizard.

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You speak many languages.

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But the beginning of every new language is not easy, it's uncomfortable.

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Hmm?

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Yeah, it is confusing.

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Yeah.

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And it's like, I thought it worked like that.

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It doesn't work like that.

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Oh, I don't know what that word is.

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Or then how these things work.

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It's like every new thing, and we don't realize it in the beginning, is uncomfortable.

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But that's part of the process.

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If you stop then, then you're lost.

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But if you just continue, it becomes easier, easier, easier by the time you don't even

notice.

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So yeah, it get better and easier and you don't even have to think because it becomes like

an autopilot.

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Yeah.

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The unconscious competence, right?

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Yeah.

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I love what you said about being comfortable in discomfort.

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And I deeply resonate with that.

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And I agree that's so important in this process.

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And you also talk about unconditioning and you said this is kind of an art.

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And what exactly is that process or what does it look like in...

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everyday life.

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Could you give us a couple of examples?

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How can we uncondition ourselves?

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Well, it starts like everything with awareness.

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Awareness that you are being conditioned.

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Which I didn't know when I was young, when I was growing up.

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So without realizing you're being conditioned by your parents, you're being conditioned by

your teachers, you're being conditioned by your boss.

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Maybe you have a partner, you're being conditioned by your partner because they all want

you to behave in a certain way.

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And even maybe you're part of a team or a group of friends or whatever.

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Like everybody to be part of the group, you have to behave in a certain way.

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And you have to detach to see

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that people only like you or people when you do exactly what they expect you to do.

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That is the awareness.

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So the awareness is like, in my hockey team, they like that when I drink beer and I was

the only one not drinking beer, they become uncomfortable with me.

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So it is the social conditioning which I realized.

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You're no longer a member of the herd.

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You're doing something different.

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They don't like you anymore.

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Number one is the awareness that there is conditioning and that you are being conditioned

well, basically throughout your life unless you step out of it.

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And some things

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take a lot of work because you have to adapt to new things.

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Another thing is by the moment I tell you that's the way it would look.

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But let me give you an example which really had a huge impact on me and has had a huge

impact on my clients.

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I'm sure about you and your clients is that

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I told you that at some point in time, I get out of the corporate world, then I got a

coach.

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And again, this 25 years ago, so that was not a natural thing to do.

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And at some point, I was discussing with him what I wanted to do now.

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Whether I would want another corporate job or something else or do this or that.

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And when I was explaining to my coach what I wanted to do,

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It's like they, said, Arnold, you only said what you don't want.

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I said, I don't want a boss.

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I don't want a company which is slow.

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I don't want something with this long process.

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Don't want this.

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Don't, you always say, but you don't want.

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I said, okay, yeah, you're right about that.

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But Arnold, what do you want?

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What?

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I literally was lost for words.

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I couldn't answer at all.

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That was when I, to your listen, I was at the beginning of my 40s.

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He asked that question and I literally didn't know what to say.

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That was the first time in my life, that someone had asked me that question.

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So that is indicative, well, my experience and many, many other people's that we're so

used that other people tells us what we have to want and what we have to do,

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that we not even ever thought about it.

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My parents, my teacher, nobody had ever asked me that question, Arnold, what do you want?

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It's a big deal, right?

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Isn't it very unnatural that I was in my 40s, but I can talk now with people in their 70s,

80s, most people still don't know because nobody had asked them that question.

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So I think that's very sad.

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It's very sad.

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And that is the realization about...

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Well, I've been totally focused on making other people happy with my behavior.

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So what I'm doing, saying, whatever, if that is in line with these other people expect

from me, I am okay.

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So that is what you could also call external validation.

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You're totally focused on the external world.

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Did I do it okay?

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Are they satisfied?

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Did I make a mistake?

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But Arnold, what do you want?

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Well, this has been my journey ever since.

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And I'm still discovering who I am and where I need to learn.

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I want to, well, need to grow, want to grow, want to understand.

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I even worked on it this morning.

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You see, like, that is a huge shift,

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that we need to start those asking those questions ourselves rather than wait for someone

else to tell us what to do.

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So that's the main thing.

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What is my definition of unconditioning is to dismantle the straight jackets of other

people's agenda.

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I so appreciate what you say about this increasing this awareness that we have and the

difference between stating what we want in a negative or in the positive.

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And even though this might be like a first step for many people, or this is what we are

used to do.

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Like when you asked me, what do I want?

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I don't want to be overweight or I don't want to be lazy.

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And maybe there's another step beyond that, that is

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I want to do this, I want to be this in a positive.

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And instead of stop being this in a sense, it's like we keep recreating that, right?

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Absolutely, but that there is a, well, you could call it conditioning, but you can also

call it a huge mistake in our lives that we think the way we are being educated is that,

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okay, you go to school, you do a certain vocational training, and then it's like, okay,

let's say you're 20, 25.

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What you're taught then is you're supposed to do the work which you choose for the next 45

years.

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That is the message which has been given is like you do that and by the time let's say

you're 70, you can retire and do nice things.

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That is the narrative upon which the whole education system is built, the whole society is

built, but that narrative is totally untrue.

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Especially in today's world where things are so rapidly changing every day that it would

be even impossible to do what you're doing today in the same thing for the next 20, 30, 40

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years.

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It doesn't exist.

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The narrative brings you in a world which maybe used to exist 100 years ago, but it

certainly doesn't exist now anymore.

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Indeed, what you said, you continuously have to adapt and learn and grow.

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But the moment you grow, the moment you start to understand, it's like, who's Walter?

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What do I like?

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You have to test, you have to try, you have to be curious.

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But maybe you try something and say, maybe I like painting.

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I tried it for a couple of months.

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I really don't like painting.

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Fine, do something else.

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So it's like you try and then you think, and then there's some other stuff.

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I really like that.

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I didn't know I would like that.

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Well, let me give my own example.

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It's writing.

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Writing in the sand or writing books.

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I just finished three small, I call them, tales, which are my first attempt at nonfiction

writing.

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I've written a couple of nonfiction books and I now can say I know how to do that and I

can do that, but this is my first attempt where I incorporate nonfiction stuff.

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That

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talking about being uncomfortable.

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So he's like, oh, okay, I had to try these things.

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But I like.

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Before that, years before that, if you would say, Arnold, you're going to be a writer and

write a couple of books, I would say, you're totally crazy.

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I don't like writing.

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But it's like, you evolve, you grow, you develop, and whatever.

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And now I'm like, I kind of like writing.

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So it's like, you have to try, but it's like, you are today not the same person as the

same person in five years, 10 years, 15, 20, et cetera.

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At that point in time, you have to adapt to what fits you, who you are in that moment.

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Yeah, we are limiting ourselves and it's like we are not using our...

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fully our imagination and we are contracting our own sense of possibility.

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And this is something I see around all the time.

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People are looking for their purpose.

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What is that I'm going to do with my life?

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And I keep, and I can keep thinking about what's my ultimate purpose and what I'm here to

do.

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And people are not willing to, to,

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go on experiments and experimenting things and trying things out and putting that into

practice and seeing what it's like.

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And instead what I see is people, prefer to just be in their head and their thoughts and

think that maybe after watching enough YouTube videos or Instagram reels, they will

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finally find out what their purpose was.

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If that was something lost, I don't know what it is.

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Yeah, well, actually, I find it very sad.

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I had that problem myself as well, because that's what all the literature says.

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And this has been going on for 20, 30 years.

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Like, oh, you need to have a purpose.

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What's your purpose?

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What's your passion?

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Yeah, like, yeah, what's that?

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I don't know.

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Yeah.

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And then I tell you, maybe it's 90 % plus the people, have no clue, but everybody's like,

oh, I need to have something.

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So in your example where people make a choice,

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it's more likely, well, let's do this.

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So that question stops bothering me.

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It's not a choice from your heart.

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It's just like, oh, I need to have an answer and I need to do this.

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And that's another sign of being uncomfortable is like, except that you don't know.

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Not knowing is fine.

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Not knowing, I say it's part of my philosophy, like, most beautiful sayings start from

being in this void.

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You're in a void is like, hey, I am here.

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Maybe I want to go there, but I don't know the next steps.

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I don't know what to do.

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in that void, that is where you learn, that is where you grow.

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that is where you say exactly like you said, experiment is like, I don't know, but let's

try painting.

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I don't like painting.

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Okay, well, maybe writing.

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Hey, that writing is nice.

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I didn't know that.

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And so it like

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experiment, try, do all these things.

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But in that void, the void is OK, whereas in our reality, they say, no, you must

constantly know what to do.

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And I think it's nonsense.

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It's it's impossible.

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It's like you grow as a human being.

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The world changes, the world grows.

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And it's like, mean, just before this call, I'm working on a new

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offering but it's like where I'm considering one of the things which which really drives

me is like what to do with AI and how to help people.

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It's incredible the number of people who are losing their jobs due to AI and it will be

even accelerating it.

416

And I give you the numbers only in the US this year.

417

So let's say it's from January to May, 700,000 people have lost their jobs.

418

It's not only AI, it's also humanoid robots, but it's like, I was envisioning like, what

does it mean for the future?

419

What does it mean for work?

420

How can I help those people?

421

What should they do?

422

Because maybe they're like, I'm going to do the same job in other go.

423

Yeah.

424

But they also have the AI and then they have this.

425

So I'm in a situation of not knowing.

426

I don't have the answers yet.

427

I hope to get somewhere.

428

But it's like, that's part of your process.

429

The part of the process is like, I don't know.

430

But I'm figuring out and I'm thinking about it and sooner or later I will get some

insights and then I will hopefully have some answers where I can help people.

431

Yeah, you're figuring it out and you're curious and you're open and you have a willingness

to learn more about that.

432

And you said something very interesting is that in this era, humans are robotized and

robots are humanized.

433

What are the implications of this?

434

Can you tell us more about that?

435

Unfortunately, the implications you see every day, there's been a lot of research and

studies and I've been speaking with people all over the world is that people's IQ

436

intelligence quotient is declining, emotional quotient is declining, mental health

quotient is declining.

437

And I'm adding another one of which are called communication intelligence is also

declining.

438

So people are not

439

comfortable anymore in critical thinking, in understanding, in memorizing, in long-term

view.

440

We can go into why that is.

441

It's clearly, in my opinion, not the fault of those people.

442

It's not the fault of the student.

443

It's the fault of a lot of other things which are happening in the world right now.

444

But that means that's what I say is like you already see that people are being robotized.

445

Look at, I'm sure in

446

Are you still in Uruguay?

447

I'm still in Uruguay, right.

448

Yeah, so it like, if you see, and it used to be a year ago, whatever, when you see young

women walking on the street, they would walk like this.

449

They would walk like with their phone in their hands.

450

Yeah, used to be mainly women.

451

This was a year ago.

452

And that's the way they walk on the sidewalk.

453

I see them every day on the sidewalk and they go to the bus station.

454

So they are already being guided by that phone.

455

What has changed now, you see young men doing it, but now you see also senior citizens

walking with this thing and sitting in the bus constantly looking at this thing.

456

That is what I call conditioning through the technology.

457

That means you're robotized because you can do nothing without this thing.

458

We are nobody.

459

We are useless without a phone.

460

Yeah, well, I'm pretty sure that 99 % of the people, suppose you're going to your work or

to your school or whatever, you're like, oh, I left my phone at home.

461

People would get totally crazy.

462

So that's why I say is what you already see and what's happening.

463

And unfortunately, you see it in the numbers is that critical thinking, understanding IQ,

everything, people cannot do anything and people cannot think, they cannot calculate.

464

They cannot calculate if I ask you what is five times 36, they don't know, they got to put

it on the phone.

465

This is already the case.

466

This is the case all over the world.

467

If you talk about, sure, that's why I say people are robotized and this is going very,

very fast and I'm very worried about that.

468

The other thing is that robots are being humanized.

469

Literally they're called humanoid robots.

470

And if you integrate, and that's what's happening is like robots with AI.

471

They almost can do anything from cooking your meal to being a barista in a coffee bar to

working in a warehouse for Amazon.

472

It's it's an even putting stuff in and out your dishwasher in your home without breaking

your plates, whatever.

473

It's like, it's totally incredible.

474

It's totally.

475

you've seen, there are now a lot of videos about

476

robots were dancing or they're jumping over things on the parkour.

477

I think I wrote it down 10 years ago.

478

This is the reality of today.

479

Yeah, it's like science fiction.

480

It's like we are living in a movie.

481

It's like a film.

482

Definitely, but that is really the case.

483

But we have to realize that we are totally losing control over our own lives.

484

And what is the place for brain fitness and the work you do here in all this turmoil and

all these changes that are happening?

485

So what I'm trying to help people with is that most people by now understand that in order

to keep your body functioning at a certain level, you need to exercise, you need to move.

486

So that is when the term body fitness or fitness in itself start to emerge.

487

When I was young, it didn't exist.

488

So anyone you ask now is like, maybe you can go to the gym, you can walk your dog, you can

play tennis, you can play football, it doesn't matter.

489

But people understand that, in order for my body to keep on functioning, and especially if

I get older, it's crucial that I do some movement, some exercise.

490

Okay?

491

But what are you doing for your brain?

492

I just explained that basically, especially already young people,

493

your brain is declining, is degrading, is declining.

494

But that would happen to your body as well.

495

Ask a person who never exercises and you can see how they are.

496

That is why it's really crucial that you do the same for your brain.

497

Your brain also after the age of 30 starts to decline.

498

At first it's slow, but the moment you get older and older, it starts faster and faster

and faster.

499

So just like with your body, you understand you get to keep on moving, getting it fit and

doing these things.

500

That's when I realized like, hey, you need to do the same thing for your brain.

501

So that means you can prevent a lot of negative things like mental illnesses, whatever,

also elderly diseases.

502

But at the same time, and you alluded to that earlier, you're like, we have so much more

potential, Walter.

503

We have so much more things that we can do.

504

How many languages again do you speak?

505

Six, seven?

506

What is it?

507

Five, five languages.

508

Five.

509

Said, most people, they only speak one language or maybe two.

510

And people was like, that's totally impossible, you're speaking five languages.

511

No, here's Walter, he speaks five.

512

I know people who speak 10 or 20.

513

uh

514

I had an uncle who had the languages, but he spoke the old version.

515

So he didn't speak Persian, but old Persian.

516

And he was a professor in old languages.

517

So it's like we can do so much more.

518

we can.

519

Everyone can do and be so much more, but we are limited what I call by straight jackets

that we cannot do these things.

520

I asked people like a year ago, there were the Olympics in Paris.

521

And I say, have you watched?

522

Yeah, yeah, I've watched that.

523

Have you seen some of the games?

524

Yeah, yeah.

525

Have you seen the gold medal winner?

526

Yeah, I've seen it.

527

Okay.

528

How many of those gold medal winners were in a straight jacket?

529

What are you saying, Arnold?

530

Strange question.

531

Of course nobody had a straight jacket.

532

Yes, why is it of course?

533

It's of course because that would be limiting, right?

534

Yes.

535

So why do you wear a straight jacket every day?

536

Because I'm not an Olympic athlete.

537

That might be the answer.

538

No, it's because I call them invisible straight jackets.

539

I have by now a list.

540

I've identified 35 different straight jackets which we are wearing.

541

Out of those 35, I would say 33 I wore myself and I didn't know.

542

So if you remove them, you're like, I didn't know I could do that.

543

I feel more free.

544

I feel more healthy.

545

My well-being increases.

546

My performance increases.

547

My creativity increases because I remove all those limitations.

548

What is the most prevalent of these straight jackets that you have numbered?

549

That you see more, like "this is all over the place"?

550

I would like to answer two.

551

Okay.

552

oh

553

What I call the subordination straight jacket is like, yeah, is whether it's at home or

with your bosses, whatever is like, hey, I'm the authority figure.

554

I'm the boss and you should be doing what what I tell you to do.

555

And

556

that way of telling these things is how do they do that is they always start to criticize

you.

557

Like, Walter, you got three faults.

558

They don't say you get seven good answers.

559

No, you get three wrong.

560

And this is your mistake.

561

And this is a failure.

562

And this is not good enough.

563

And you should think the consequences of that is that I would say without exception, I

haven't met any person who's not that we all have the feeling that we're not good enough.

564

Everybody recognized that is if I say, be honest, do you have the feeling you're not good

enough?

565

Yeah, I have that feeling.

566

I also have that feeling.

567

It's still part of me.

568

It's that is because of subordination, because the way to keep you low is to constantly

point you is like, that's not good.

569

That's not good.

570

That's not

571

What would be the second?

572

The second one is done in religion and in spirituality, whatever it is that they have the

same approach.

573

Well, in most religion, they tell you you're a sinner.

574

You're not good enough.

575

You didn't do these things okay.

576

And you have to shape up.

577

Otherwise, you get to hell.

578

You don't want to go to hell.

579

But now you're not good enough.

580

You got to change these things.

581

And it doesn't matter whether you're a Catholic or a Buddhist or Islam.

582

It doesn't matter.

583

It's all the same.

584

You are a sinner.

585

You're doing a lot of things wrong and you should change that.

586

Yeah, so.

587

To close this conversation, to close this conversation, if each listener today would have

to take one small step toward unconditioning themselves, something small that they can do

588

today, they can start practicing right now, not tomorrow, what would that be?

589

Very simple and very difficult at the same time.

590

I would invite you to be kind to yourself.

591

Kind to ourselves.

592

Yeah.

593

Thank you.

594

Is there anything else that you'd like to add to this conversation ?

595

And I know that you have something, a resource to share with us and with my audience about

what you do.

596

And before sharing that, is there anything else you'd like to share about that we haven't

covered?

597

Well, I normally say as a starting point, there are three starting points and they're

quite crucial in this respect.

598

Number one is it's not your fault.

599

Meaning, most of us feel lousy, have health problems, mental, emotional challenges, have

everything.

600

But we all think because of that conditioning that it's our fault.

601

And I say it's not your fault.

602

I explained a little bit how it's your environment which has impacted you.

603

And even when you're growing up as a kid, you have no influence on that.

604

Realize it's not your fault.

605

There's nothing wrong with you.

606

Number two, I alluded to that as well, is that I would say, nook the narrative and start

writing your own story.

607

So don't believe all the narratives from the COVID to the religious one, to that we all

have to go into the AI thing, whatever it is like.

608

No.

609

Create your own story.

610

And number three is instead of what we're doing in the conditioning is that you're living

from the outside in.

611

How do people react to me and what do they expect me to do and what do they want me to do

live from the inside out?

612

Wonderful.

613

So we are concluding this episode with those three.

614

I appreciate that.

615

And where can people experience and get to know more about the work that you do?

616

And is there anything you'd like to share with my audience?

617

I know that there's a masterclass.

618

Yes, I have basically two kinds of offerings on my website.

619

It's called braingym.fitness.

620

And my masterclass are videos about a specific topic.

621

They're around 90 minute videos, like finding out what your uniqueness is.

622

I think that's a much better question than your purpose.

623

So figure out what your uniqueness is.

624

It's about relationships.

625

It's about stimulating your curiosity.

626

It's about dealing with emotion.

627

So a couple of different topics specific for that topic.

628

It's a workshop I do with someone else, but there are questions with you, hopefully apply

to your own life.

629

So those are the master classes and the main training from fitting into find out is the 15

week training where there's one 90 minute session each week.

630

And in the period in between you start to apply it, you start to learn, you start to

research things around it.

631

And then

632

the next week.

633

So there's a 15 week training to help you to make that shift from fitting in to flying

out.

634

So that's all on BrainGym.Fitness.

635

If you still have questions or need something to ask me, there's a link to my agenda so

you can book a meeting with me and we can just have a conversation.

636

Wonderful.

637

Thank you so much, Arnold.

638

It's been great.

639

I learned a lot and I know that my audience also will expand their views and their sense

of possibility around learning and their sense of fitness beyond body fitness to brain

640

fitness and the other things that we covered today.

641

Thank you so much.

642

Thank you, Walter.